This interview was completed in late October 1999 and published in the top UK Muay Thai magazine called "The OFFICIAL UNITED KINGDOM MUAYTHAI Magazine.
United Kingdom MuayThai Magazine: Why did you start training in the Martial Arts?
Kru Mike Miles: : Well, I was your typical Canadian kid playing hockey, but when I was nine years old I froze my feet so bad that I had to quit skating. In Canada, more months are cold than warm so I had to find some way to keep active during the winter. Secondly, I was fairly big and uncoordinated as a boy so a lot of kids tried to pick on me. I always managed to defend myself all right as a kid, but I wanted to learn to do it more effectively. The Martial Arts seemed to be the answer.
UKMTM: Do you have anything you would like to say about how the Martial Arts are perceived today?
Kru Mike Miles: My biggest criticism is it seems to be glorified violence. Some kids are learning the Martial Arts now so they can hang out with gangs and bully other people. This could have something to do with the way they are brought up, peer pressure, or even the instructors they train with. Unfortunately, look at the entertainment industry and you will see actors like Jean Claude Van Damme and Steven Seagal up on the screen glorifying the violence. Ironically, in real life most people turn to the Martial Arts because it is a tool to turn them into a better human being as well as offer that individual a competitive outlet if they desire. Amateur and Professional MuayThai offer a great competitive outlet for athletes who are training seriously.
UKMTM: What got you involved in the ring aspect of the Arts?
Kru Mike Miles: In team sports I had to rely on everybody doing a good job to win. I was always frustrated that if I put in a good performance and if several others were not doing so well in their performance, we would lose. I liked the individualistic aspect of the sport. If I trained hard and did my gym work, I would most likely win. If I slacked then I would lose and have no one to blame but myself. In the traditional Martial Arts I also got tired of the mentality of certain people being the best without ever having to do the activity (claiming to be the 'deadliest' fighter without ever making contact). In MuayThai competition, your physical skills and your mental resolve are tested. No one wins bouts all the time and even if you lose, you can still win by learning from what went wrong with the bout. I like the physical and mental competition of MuayThai and always have.
UKMTM: What is your background in fighting in the ring?
Kru Mike Miles: I am acknowledged as a Pioneer in the sport of Full Contact, 'Kickboxing', and MuayThai in Canada. Before I go any further, in North America 'Kickboxing' nowadays is a generic term. It means Full Contact rules (competition allowing only kicks above the waist), Kickboxing rules (allowing kicks to the inside and outside of the thighs also) and MuayThai (full or modified rules with knees and elbows). In the early 1970's Full Contact rules were started in North America (kicking above the waist only) and I started my competition here. By the late 1970's, I was introduced and started working with another hero of mine Benny "The Jet" Urquidez. This was the beginning of my Kickboxing phase. As MuayThai competition started making inroads into North America in the late 1980's I too started competing and was one of the first to fight, promote, and teach MuayThai in Canada.
UKMTM: When did you start your training in MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: In the late 1970's I had a student from Thailand who had also trained and fought in MuayThai in his home country. He started teaching me MuayThai and though there was no competitive outlet for it in North America, I was interested in learning. In the early and mid 1980's, I brought in many "MuayThai" instructors to my gym for seminars and some were good while others were absolutely awful. I mean I can think of one Laos instructor who was teaching us Karate style elbows and was trying to pan it off to us as MuayThai! That was when I decided it was time to get very serious and go and train in Thailand. I have trained in a few very prominent MuayThai camps in Thailand. In the late 1980's a student of mine went to Thailand and he bumped into my present instructor Ajarn Panya Kraitus. It was here that I started my affiliation with Ajarn Panya.
UKMTM: How long have you been teaching MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: I have been teaching strictly MuayThai since the late 1980's. I have concentrated on the traditional aspect, but in the later years I have been concentrating on the realistic and practical aspect of the art. I teach what works and that is what counts. As a student progresses I then turn to some of the more very traditional and old aspects of MuayThai.
UKMTM: Have you practised any other Martial Arts?
Kru Mike Miles: I have been involved in the Martial Arts for over 3 decades and when I first started training we were very limited as to what kind of styles we could practise. There was Judo, Karate, Wrestling and Boxing. I started off in the Karate and after a few years Tae Kwon-Do came into it's own. I liked the kicking aspect so I went to that style. I studied this for a few years but found it was lacking in realistic training and especially hand skills. So I somewhat evolved and started training in boxing. At that point Full Contact was starting and I decided to get involved in that aspect of the sport completely abandoning TKD. I started working with boxers and some of the Pioneers and Legends from North America and the fighting cocktail of Martial Arts oriented kicks and boxing style hand work. Eventually my training evolved to allowing kicks to the legs influenced by the Thai style and Japanese Kickboxing. I have also learned Boxe Francaise-Savate from a student of mine from France. To me though, MuayThai is it.
UKMTM: Why did you decide to take up MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: My Thai student and his MuayThai technique literally blew everything else away. The Martial Arts oriented style kicks could not deal with the effectiveness of the Thai style kicking. I liked the fact that MuayThai had been proving itself on the battlefield and in the ring for a long time. By contrast, American Full Contact was a very new sport with the rules still evolving. But it was frustrating because there was no MuayThai competition available at the time. Since starting MuayThai I have always been (and still am) a student of the Art. I want to continue learning all aspects of MuayThai until the day I die.
UKMTM: At this stage of your career, are there other things you wish to explore?
Kru Mike Miles: What amazes me is my instructor Ajarn Panya Kraitus. He has showed me so much technique. What is ironic is that many of the fighters from Thailand do not even understand some of his techniques and tactics anymore. You see, the present sport has been somewhat watered down. Fighters have learned only so much of the technique from their Ajarn and then they retire and become involved with a camp and teach a little less of the technique to the next generation and so on and so on. Eventually, you are left with considerably less than what one started with. I am continually surprised at how much of the Art will be lost as each old Master passes on. I have met and talked with some very old Masters who have abandoned the commercial aspect of MuayThai after they have criticised the business and competitive end of the sport. Upon discussing some of the very old techniques that Ajarn Panya has taught me, I am always delighted to see the eyes of these Masters light up with pride in the true art of MuayThai. What is even more amazing to me is when they pass on other old concepts to me as well. I have been honoured and very lucky with my MuayThai pursuits. Smart MuayThai practitioners are searching out the old hidden Masters. Do not be naive enough to believe that all the 'traditional' knowledge is under the guidance of just one MuayThai organisation.
UKMTM: You have trained with Kickboxers and Full Contact athletes who have been perceived by partisan MuayThai practitioners as people who put down MuayThai and are the villains against the successful spread of MuayThai world-wide. What do you have to say about this?
Kru Mike Miles: I am tired of seeing this stuff as well. You must understand that writers have the responsibility of getting the facts correct. I have been misquoted and seen things I have never said in the media many times before. This is the case with a lot of these champions. I have taken teams to fight in Thailand many times representing Canada. Now for the kicker, the 'villains' that partisan MuayThai supporters point to such as Benny "The Jet" Urquidez, Bill "Superfoot" Wallace, Jean Yves "The Iceman" Theriault, Chuck Norris, Bob "Ohara" Wall, Peter "Sugarfoot" Cunningham, Don "The Dragon" Wilson have all played their part in helping me get the money to get Team Canada to compete MuayThai in Thailand. I think that just about contradicts everything ever said about their anti-MuayThai stance. These people are entitled to personal opinions as is everyone else, but if they were so against MuayThai, why would they help me get a full contingent of athletes to fight full MuayThai in Thailand?
UKMTM: Let's talk about your events. You seem to have your athletes battle under any rules.
Kru Mike Miles: Unfortunately, I will take fights for my athletes under any rules that I can get them (except grappling) right now. My athletes will train for Full MuayThai bouts and make the adjustment to modified MuayThai rules (no elbow attacks and no knees to the head), or they will make the adjustment to fight under Kickboxing (leg kicking) rules, or further make the adjustment to Full Contact rules or even Boxing rules. It is not a perfect world. I would love to fight strictly MuayThai but geographically Canada is very isolated and it is very difficult to find competition. In Europe it is so easy to find competition for MuayThai and a lot less expensive for promoters. It is expensive for me to consistently bring in opponents from around the world for my amateur athletes to battle with. My athletes average 10 fights a year. My amateurs fight athletes from all over the world. I have brought in athletes from the USA, Mexico, England, Brazil, Uganda, France, Spain, Germany, Holland, Hungary, Russia, Ukraine, Poland, Thailand, Japan, China, Korea, Philippines and Australia. For North America, my amateur athletes get better international experience than most the professional athletes on this continent. However, to keep expenses down on events I have to fill the undercard with whatever types of rules bouts I can.
UKMTM: What do you hope to accomplish by teaching students who have no interest in fighting in the ring?
Kru Mike Miles: 99% of my clientele are not interested in competing in the ring. 70% of my clientele are women! I want to build their self-esteem, which in turn will turn them into better people. I teach all kinds of people who also want a practical form of self-defence and an excellent way to stay in shape. My clientele ranges from professionals (celebrities, executives) to housewives to people who are studying in school. Finally, I hope to find the students who will be better than me, get all the information I have to offer and let them continue their journey in the Art learning more, so in turn the aspects of the Art I have taught them, get better.
UKMTM: Who has been the biggest influence in your life?
Kru Mike Miles: I would have to say the ladies and instructors in my life. My mother put up with my tunnel vision and I know at times it was very trying on her. I ate, slept, and drank Martial Arts. I am surprised she put up with the overwhelming and constant repetition. She supported me in my training both financially and spiritually. I do not think I could have done what I have without her love and her help. Unfortunately, she passed away suddenly in May of this year. My sister and my wife have been very accurate and influential with their feelings about situations and opportunities I have faced while involved in the Arts. Their approval of things I do has always been important and there when I needed it. Finally Ajarn Panya Kraitus as he is a true Master. He is very humble, which I have found to be very refreshing in the Martial Arts and he has an incredible wealth of knowledge! I have had several instructors in the past who felt they were to be treated as Gods. Ajarn is a great example of an instructor and more so as a human being. Anyone who literally calls himself a "Master" is not. To me, I owe my MuayThai to him and I respect that very much.
UKMTM: Do not all organisations teach the traditional aspects of MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: I am not trying to point fingers at anyone. Each organisation has a different set of advisors. But these advisors do not have all the knowledge of traditional MuayThai. MuayThai is rich and diverse. There are lots of old Masters that want nothing to do with some of these organisations. And some have very good reasons: We have had involvement with Amateur MuayThai around the world. During several competitions we were invited to take part in what was called the 'Mongkon Ceremony'. This is a very important tradition that should be kept between the teacher of the camp and the student. But this ceremony had politicians handing out the mongkon's to all the participants. In respect to my instructor Ajarn Panya Kraitus and my lineage, we did not participate. Several of the advisors to the organisation came and talked to me afterwards and told me that traditionally I had done the right thing. These advisors even told me that the ceremony as it was taking place was very wrong. I knew I did the correct thing and really did not care about the political backlash. Even worse is the fact that one organisation is trying to standardise the Ram Muay and Wai Kru. This ceremony shows respect and honour to one's lineage. Many traditional Masters of MuayThai in Thailand are furious about this. I asked one advisor of this organisation why he would support this organisation if he was dead set against the standardisation of the Wai Kru. I was blown away and disappointed by his answer, but he had the nerve to tell me the truth. All I will say is he did not have the interests of MuayThai at heart.
UKMTM: What about some of the tales told about MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: I am literally disgusted at times by the way MuayThai is sold to the public at times. We have all heard the stories of the hands being wrapped in rope hemp and dipped in crushed glass and glue with fighters fighting until the death. There have been a few cases of this but in reality, MuayThai was practised very compassionately when bouts between Thai's took place. Sounds crazy huh? But competitors in the old days before the advent of the boxing ring, weight classes, leather boxing gloves, and standardised rules (of what is now called modern MuayThai) were not out to kill each other. It was a way of testing ones skills, gaining notoriety and most of all putting rice on the plate. These fairy tales of trying to kill each other takes MuayThai and makes us all look like killers. Fighting with hands bound with rope hemp is called Muay Kard Chuerk. Just putting the hemp onto the hands is a dying art. Few people know how to wrap, more importantly, even less know how to make and place the knots on the hand while wrapping them so the hand does not get damaged when striking, and so the opponent gets cut. Many say they know how, but only a few in reality really know how to do it.
UKMTM: What else made Muay Kard Chuerk different than the MuayThai of today.
Kru Mike Miles: I could go on and on but as a whole I will say clinchwork. It was not really until the standardising of the rules, standardised leather boxing gloves, weight divisions, and a boxing ring that the clinch or 'clinchwork' really came into it's own as a strong ring tactic. Back to the hemp, glass and glue tales of MuayThai. In the old days, athletes would take the hemp and soak it in a mixture of tapioca powder and water. The hemp was then hanged and when it was dry it took on a glassy effect. The hemp was then rubbed together and this would make it sparkle in the light like crushed glass. It would make the hemp very hard, abrasive, and sharp when rubbed against an opponent's body. An opponent raking his hands across the body of an opponent who was trying to clinch was very painful from the stiff and sharp hemp. This served to limit the time the two athletes engaged each other in a clinch (not like today). Imagine how painful the clinch would have been had a fighter been raked across the face or body with crushed glass and glue. Wearing the leather boxing gloves of today does nothing to discourage the use of the clinch. Smooth leather does not hurt when it gets raked over the body. Thus some camps and more so some athletes have made careers out of their clinch (Dieselnoi).
UKMTM: What does Ajarn Panya think of the clinch.
Kru Mike Miles: Ajarn Panya does not like the two armed neck clinch. He calls it dancing and believes that the athlete should go dancing with his wife or girlfriend, not with this opponent. However, with the current rules and gloves there is lots of validity in using the clinch. Ajarn has a lot of defences for the clinch but sometimes my students are restricted by the rules as to what we can use or can not use. In North America it is almost impossible to find athletes who will fight full MuayThai allowing elbows. Ironically, the correct use of the elbow can discourage the clinch. However, if you can not use the elbow one is stuck with the reality that you will most likely fall into a clinch and it is best to understand and be very versatile with it. I understand Ajarn Panya and I admire his knowledge, background and technique but sometimes he gets frustrated when we (my athletes and I) work the clinch. Sometimes it is hard to always deal with what the preconceived idea of what a clinch should be like (from the athletes). Ajarn has so many defences out of a clinch that at times even the athletes do not believe it will work until it suddenly does when they try it. But again, I have to do what ever we will be able to do in competition. For us, rules for MuayThai are not cohesive in North America.
UKMTM: So Ajarn Panya is totally against the use of the clinch?
Kru Mike Miles: He does not like it because he feels you lose the use of many weapons (fists, elbows, forearms), but he knows how to use it. However there are different ways of clinching and he prefers the use of the clinch as it applies to Muay Chaiya.
UKMTM: His book 'MuayThai - The Most Distinguished Art of Fighting' has no chapter in it on the use of the clinch. Why is this?
Kru Mike Miles: Ajarn's book has no clinch work in it because of his faithfulness to his instructor Supreme Master Kyet Sriyapai requests. Ajarn wrote the book on a promise to his Master and what he was told to have in the book. Muay Chaiya focuses heavily on the use of the elbow and the forearm and its defence against the knee and the clinch. Ajarn Panya made his decision on what would be allowed into his book and what would not be by this promise to his instructor's criteria. Frankly, his book covers modern style MuayThai and there is very little Muay Chaiya technique in it.
UKMTM: A few moments ago you stated MuayThai rules in North America are not cohesive? What do you mean?
Kru Mike Miles: The kind of rules used in 'MuayThai' varies from region to region, state to state, province to province. I have seen World MuayThai Title bouts where they did not allow the elbow, the knee or even a leg kick (ISKA - Curtis Schuster vs. Wade Irwin)! Ridiculous. I have seen the rules go beyond from being modified to downright handicapped. Let me give a few examples. Peter Cunningham, I know and respect the man. However he has fought MuayThai bouts where no elbows were allowed and knees were only allowed without a clinch. Yes, you heard me correctly, no clinch. Do you realise how difficult it is to sustain a knee attack without clinching your opponent? He has beaten Prasert Kittikasem under these rules and the Thai was frustrated because he could not adjust to the rules. In the same bout, foot sweeps and reaps were allowed, when this is illegal in real MuayThai bouts. Everytime Prasert tried to knee he was swept to the ground. So was this an example of real MuayThai? No, it just reinforces the fact that there are no cohesive rules in North America though a few of us are trying. This example does not point a finger at my friend Peter Cunningham but at the sanctioning bodies and the various Commissions at work in North America.
UKMTM: What about your MuayThai lineage?
Kru Mike Miles: I have a respecte lineage in Thailand. It is funny because every organisation in Thailand tries to use one of Thailand's most celebrated (and controversial) Masters to demonstrate and sell the technique of MuayThai used in their organisation. This man is Ajarn Kyet Sriyapai and he was a great man and very respected in Thailand. He took Ajarn Panya under his wing and taught him everything he knew. My lineage goes to Ajarn Panya who in turn had several teachers including Supreme Master Kyet Sriyapai.
UKMTM: What do you mean Master Kyet was controversial?
Kru Mike Miles: Ajarn Kyet had become disenchanted with the modern ring version of MuayThai. He felt the Art had been prostituted by the influence of business and felt that more and more of the fighters were losing the skills of the traditional art. He was controversial because he was dead set against teaching foreigners MuayThai. He felt that the foreigner would not understand the spiritual aspect of the Art and secondly, if foreigners became as proficient as the Thai's and both battled, the Thai would lose because of the size and strength differences.
UKMTM: Why did Ajarn teach you instead of sticking to athletes of Thai heritage?
Kru Mike Miles: I have asked him this as well and he has been pretty vague but I was one of the lucky ones. When I went and lived with Ajarn he put me through many trials and tribulations to see whether or not I wanted to really learn MuayThai and to test my character. Three days into my training he told me he was going to send me to another camp. I was devastated. The next day he caught me practising very hard by myself and the walls (defence mechanisms between us) came down. He mellowed a bit and he started showing me more traditional technique. But he still put me through many tests. He filled his fridge with beer and had packages of cigarettes around. I was surprised he drank or smoke but I did not question it. A week later I went to pull some food out of the fridge and dropped a few cans of beer on the floor and they opened. I panicked and I cleaned it up and then spent hours trying to find the same brand name to replace the damaged ones. Finally I did. About a week later he asked me if I was going to drink the beer or not. I told him I did not drink and I told him that I was surprised he drank. He told me he did not. I then told him about the accident and the panic I went through and we laughed for weeks about this. Needless to say, the beer went in the garbage. I have around seven volumes of notes on Muay Chaiya and MuayThai from when I was living with him. The notes continually surprise me because everytime I review a page, I always remember other things. He taught me a lot! I went through similar types of trials when I was training at the Muangsurin camp. They wanted to test my grit and mettle. I went through many painful periods to see whether or not I had the required stuff. In the end I won out but I will tell you, I questioned myself many times during that period of time.
UKMTM: What is your goal for MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: My goal is to see MuayThai make the Olympics. There is a lot of misleading information out there and all I can say is the fact of the matter is that IFMA is the only organisation that has the support of the Olympic Committee of Thailand. The AMTAT and FAMA (all organisations under the umbrella of IFMA) are the responsible ones for getting MuayThai involved with the Asian Games, no one else. The Asian games are a step closer to the Olympic Games. Since competition in the Olympics is my goal, I want to have my athletes able to compete. Olympic competition is my goal so I can train athletes to represent Canada.
UKMTM: What about your competitive involvement with Ajarn Panya Kraitus?
Kru Mike Miles: Ajarn was instrumental in the founding of the World MuayThai Council back in the early 1990's. We fought internationally on some of his events in the Orient. By 1995, the Thai government and army wanted to use the name World Muay Thai Council and he relinquished the name. He has grown rather tired of the fight game. I understand his feelings and will not talk for him. Ajarn would be best to explain his own feelings why he does not really care for competition much anymore.
UKMTM: What is your working relationship with Ajarn Panya Kraitus?
Kru Mike Miles: I lived with Ajarn and picked his brain day and night. He has shown me so much that at time I forget things. I have a series of 7 manuals of notes. Everytime I look in them I find new things that I have forgotten. It constantly amazes me. I do what Ajarn requests though at times he is not always thrilled with my decisions, as I have said I want my athletes to compete and we will fight just about anywhere under any rules just to get the work. He has scolded me but he understands my decisions. Both he has been talking about (and I are in the midst) of putting together a video series on MuayThai as it applies to tradition and as well as how it applies to the ring aspect. I have a very large series of manuscripts on fighting I have been wrestling with about getting published for years now. But is covers all aspects of the ring from MuayThai to Kickboxing to Full Contact; from a boxer's jab to the ways the punch can change and vary to suit the need. It is very impressive but I have not decided if I will publish it yet or not. I think it might be something to publish when I decide to retire.
UKMTM: Why not publish it now?
Kru Mike Miles: It features all the information I have picked up by training with boxers, from MuayThai camps I have trained at in Thailand, from athletes, fighters, coaches, etc. Truthfully, I think I hesitate on publishing it because there will be other information I wanted to put in but did not take the book. So I feel it will be like a finished canvas still missing that little something extra special. Maybe as I age, I will be happy to finish the canvas rather than dwell on what I might be missing.
UKMTM: Do you teach traditional MuayThai?
Kru Mike Miles: You know what, I agree there is traditional MuayThai curriculum out there. Is it a complete representation of traditional MuayThai? No. However who does one believe? For example, one organisation claims to teach traditional MuayThai. Where did they get their curriculum from? They got it from several Masters of MuayThai who learned their skills without the organisation they represent. But the organisation did not use the material of all the old Masters of different camps. Frankly, one organisation tried to use parts of Ajarn Panya's book for their seminars on real MuayThai until Ajarn Panya spoke up. The threat of a lawsuit with this organization ended up on the front pages of Bangkok's newspapers. This organisation no longer uses Ajarn Panya's book so does that make Ajarn Panya an instructor who does not teach traditional MuayThai? Ridiculous. One advisor of an organisation told me there was no such thing as complimentary tricks and master tricks, etc. in MuayThai. Two years later he is one of the authors of a book for an organisation on their curriculum of required tricks. I could not believe it. If a Master has no interest in being involved with one 'traditional' organisation, does that make him less credible? I can think of a person who claims to teach 'traditional' Muay Thai and says I do not because we do not wear the traditional dress. Since when does what you wear dictate what you are teaching? This guy has never even been in the ring before! I teach MuayThai and as the student develops I add in more traditional MuayThai.
UKMTM: How traditional of a format do you follow?
Kru Mike Miles: I hold back on many aspects of the Art when teaching new students. I am not going to teach them new tactics that can really hurt someone when I do not know the individuals mental make up. I have had some 'characters' come to be taught, but they have all had the wrong attitude so I really put the reins on what I will teach them. Eventually they get bored with the basics and go and train in some other style. Realistically, I can not control each student's personal life, but still I feel a responsibility for them. I, like most genuine Martial Arts instructors, am not interested in teaching a bunch of 'heavies'. In regards to the more dangerous tactics and techniques, Ajarn Panya told me to be careful to find my own successor to pass my knowledge on to. My own son has not even seen some of these tactics and skills yet! I am patiently waiting for the right time for him/her and possibly another person(s). Finally, the main reason I have made some of the changes is that many of the training routines are deeply based in tradition and people would not understand them. In this day and age of instant everything, these repetitive exercises can appear boring and gruelling possibly discouraging a person of talent from continuing his journey in the Art. Some of the exercises I did in Thailand were very brutal. Take a four foot tall trunk of a banana tree that has been cut down and sharpened on one end and then support it so it is standing upright. Automatically when you let it go it will fall onto it's side onto the ground. How many people do you know that would use their shins to kick the trunk to keep it upright for six minutes continuously? If the trunk falls over and hits the ground before the six minutes is up, one starts the time requirement all over again. These are things I doubt people over here in North America would do and most likely they would give up learning the Art in frustration.
UKMTM: The trunk of a tree! Did that not hurt?
Kru Mike Miles: A banana tree has a hard core but it is very pulpy and fleshy around the core. If you tried this exercise with North American wood you would be crazy. These stories of athletes kicking and training on trees have taken up a new life of its own. Banana trees are not hard like pine, oak, poplar... trees.
UKMTM: Thank you for the interesting reading Mike.
Kru Mike Miles: Your welcome MuayThai Mag.